Posts by Frazzled UBM

62

Roll call of those of us stuck in for our spouse or whos spouse is still in!

by BU2B in

jw
friends

i just wanted to get a feel for how many here have awakened to ttatt but are still carrying on some jw activities to pacify them and keep the peace.

also trying to hear from those who have left, but whose spouse has stayed in the wt and in the marriage.. for me it comes down to my own mental anguish.

i am mentally tortured by attending the meetings, yet i feel compelled to because my wife would kill me with her personality if i had her drag 2 small girls by herself there.

Frazzled UBM

Raton - I am in the same boat as you. I overloaded my wife with TTATT and it was totally counterproductive - she went into full cult personality mode and shut down. According to my new improved apprach I don't speak to her about TTATT at all. I love bomb her and arrange family activities to do as an alternative to the KH.

It is a matter of using Witness recruiting tactics in reverse - love bombing and doing a good witness (by showijng through your behaviour that worldly peole are ntowaht the WBTS portays us as. If you are going to introduce TTATT I would use that approach rather than attack doctrine. Something along the lines of 'What did they say about worldly people in the WT study, Awake, Watchtower or in the meeting this week?' When they said that did you think of me? Do you think I behave in the way they say worldly peole behave? What about (name your familoy members who are not Witnesses who she is fond of) are they like that?' This should start to introduce doubt. Good luck

BU2B - hang in there buddy and keep up the good fight. Cheers Fraz

62

Roll call of those of us stuck in for our spouse or whos spouse is still in!

by BU2B in

jw
friends

i just wanted to get a feel for how many here have awakened to ttatt but are still carrying on some jw activities to pacify them and keep the peace.

also trying to hear from those who have left, but whose spouse has stayed in the wt and in the marriage.. for me it comes down to my own mental anguish.

i am mentally tortured by attending the meetings, yet i feel compelled to because my wife would kill me with her personality if i had her drag 2 small girls by herself there.

Frazzled UBM

I never was a Witness but my wife is - she has stopped going regularly so she spends time with me and my son. I arrange a lot of family activities on Sundays to keep her away from the KH. She doesn't talk to me about what is going on in her head because she views me as an opposer and so is not open about what she is thinking. This can be very frustrating.

I don't think she knows TTATT but I suspect she has started to question what is taught about worldly people and the imminent arrival of Armageddon. Sometimes the cult personality appears when the guilt and shame for not attending the KH seems to kick in. I suspect this may be triggered by shepherding calls (I overheard at least one call form an elder) but she won't acknowledge that.

I have offered to write letters or pay for legal advice to protect her from being df'd or pressured to da but she has not taken me up on the offer. Things are much better than a year ago when she attended regularly but the not knowing what she is thinking is difficult.

31

Large scale War in the Middle East

by designs in

is this spreading conflict, war, in syria and iraq, inevitable and some argue necessary.. new leaders rising with napoleon size ambitions, old monarchies trying to hold on to power.. religious ideologies and groups challenging one another.

battles for natural resources and redrawing lands and boundries.. are there parallels to wwi and wwii..

Frazzled UBM

designs - the answer to your OP is a resounding 'No'. There will not be another World War like WWI and WWII. We live in the age of civil wars and small regional skirmishes. That is all that is happening in Iraq and Syria. And even those civil conflicts are minor when compared to many others since WWII (Korea, Vietnam, Rwanda, Bosnia, Afghanistan etc.). Iraq may be heading towards some form of partition with the Kurds peeling off but it will be more difficult to separate the Sunnis and Shia and eventually the Shia majority will prevail (with Iran's help). The Islamicists causing trouble in Iraq are Sunnis and this has created an interesting alliance of conveience between the US and Iran. In Syria, Assad will hang on and gradually reassert control and the West's criticism of Assad has dulled as the West has realised that the Syrian rebels are mostly Islamicists. Tit for tat violence between Israel and the Palestinians is an old story and no worse than over the past 65 years. These conflicts are containable but if Iraq does start to break-up it will certainly increase tension as the neighbouring countries jockey for position and seek to protect their interests. George W created this geo-strategic crisis when he got rid of Saddam but the US will remain sufficiently engaged to make sure it doesn't spiral out of control. Your anxiety reflects your lack of a deep understanding of the region and the causes and history of the current conflicts. The best way to ease this anxiety is to learn more so you can put these events in context. Fraz

16

July 6 WT Study- Lesson they want you to learn

by bruh2012 in

- if you have a problem with someone in the congregation -it's your fault.

- only brothers have the immorality problem.

- brothers have 4 main vices on his mental shelf.

Frazzled UBM

just keep that blame the victim mentality rolling

38

Are You A Patriotic Person Since Leaving The Witnesses?

by minimus in

jw
friends

i'm into politics but i still don't consider myself patriotic..

Frazzled UBM

It is sometimes difficult to draw a line between Patriotism (Nationalism) and Jingoism. It is a form of super-tribalim - identification with one group to the exclusion of others. That may be harmless but when it translates into a sense of superiority or specialness - then it can become irrational or lacking in objectivity or an impediment to self-criticsm or inflexibility in thinking. Then it has negative overtones. A particular view of US nationalism resulted in the invasion of Iraq. This was a mistake which has back-fired badly. For most non-Americans (except Tony Blair and John Howard) it was apparent at the time that this was a bad idea. I remember having an argument with a couple of Americans immediately prior to the invasion about why it was a bad idea it was very simlar to trying to explain TTATT to a Witness who deosn't want to hear it. Full on cognitive dissonance - they couldn't rebut my arguments but became quite belligerent at my suggestion that the US administration had misread the situation and jumping to action far too quickly.

8

Raising Children in more than one language

by SonoftheTrinity in

i recently told my wife that i am speaking only in the jamaican dialect from now on in my house because she has failed to teach her children her native language because she has put religion first, manners and discipline second, their education third, and her native language somewhere at the bottom.

while i am not jamaican, nor have i been to jamaica i lived in a jamaican rastafarian community as a rastafarian.

i am now orthodox christian as are many rastafarians and i still consider myself culturally rastafarian but no longer identify with their heresies.

Frazzled UBM

My son spent the first 3 years of his life speaking Tagalog but now speaks English exclusively and has forgotten his Tagalog and now at 8 resists my wife and my attempts to get him to speak Tagalog. In my case my wife, who is a Witness, is fully on board with my son speaking her native language. She is a member of a Tagalog congregation (when she goes, which thankfully at the moment is very seldom). I hope he iwllk become more willing to relearn Tagalog when he is older because I agree with you that speaking more than one language is very helpful educationally and it will also help him to communicate better with his cousins in the Philippines when we visit.

22

Changes in DF reporting

by fader77 in

to all bodies of elders.

re: notification of disfellowshipping or disassociation.

dear brothers:.

Frazzled UBM

It is just so bureaucratic - where do these guys get off claiming to be spiritual - they are just a bunch of petty bureaucrats...

14

A few bad apples hey?

by sparrowdown in

jw
friends

a witness couple just called on me.

they know i have'nt been to the hall for a few months but have no idea that i am "off reservation" in more ways than one.. they called by to tell me they that due to the "unloving spirit" in our.

congregation they will be going to another hall from now on.. the husband has been having ongoing "issues" with the cobe for some time ( iow,he hates his guts).. they feel that if they move to another cong where the people are nicer everything will be ok. (yeah, right).

Frazzled UBM

Bide your time and check back in with them in 6 months after the love bombing has ended and they have started to get the same treatment at the new congregation and then ask the question about whether they still think the problem is only at the old congregation...

27

This will be a GREAT organization!

by Kensho in

when...... 1) we follow christ example not the gb.

2) stop df'ing those for challenging current or past doctrine and allow us to use our god given gift of reason and free wil.

sure kick out the scumbags even the lions club have rules for membership, but not those who just use their brains and consience.. 3) get rid of the nonsensical blood teaching that has cost the lives of thousands and beg god for forgiveness.

Frazzled UBM

YES Billy with first preference going to victims of sex abuse and retirement age r&F with no retirement income

27

This will be a GREAT organization!

by Kensho in

when...... 1) we follow christ example not the gb.

2) stop df'ing those for challenging current or past doctrine and allow us to use our god given gift of reason and free wil.

sure kick out the scumbags even the lions club have rules for membership, but not those who just use their brains and consience.. 3) get rid of the nonsensical blood teaching that has cost the lives of thousands and beg god for forgiveness.

Frazzled UBM

Kensho - you forgot to add:

Stop requiring unquestioning obedience and group think

Stop using guilt, shame and fear of a jealous petty cruel supreme being to manipulate and control

Stop indoctrinating children

Stop the conditional love based on the extent of your unquestioning obedience and group think

Stop making the r&f feel bad for not doing enough

Stop selectively quoting from the Bible to suit particular purposes and otherwise engaging in misleading and deceptive conduct

...and the list goes on...

and what would happen if you did all those things... the organisation would not exist and you have to start thinking for yourself

stop grasping at straws and thinking if only the orgnaistion would reform it would be okay...it is rotten to its very core as others have pointed out and if you eraqdicate the rottenness there is nothing left...

...the idea of loving one's neighbour and being honest and upright is not unique to the Witnesses - it is basic decency and thoughtfulness and shouldn't exist only because you think you have a mean vengeful supreme being looking over your shoulder all the time...